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New dental corporate will break the mould

25th Jan 2012

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Dental business guru, Chris Barrow, and corporate owner, Dr Al Kwong Hing, are launching a new dental business corporate in March.

The launch of BKH Healthcare takes place at The Dentistry Show 2012 on Friday 2 March.

Chris Barrow has been a consultant to the dental profession for 16 years.

In the last 10 years, he has worked as a director at Integrated Dental Holdings and as a non-executive director of several other corporate companies.

In July 2010, he joined forces with existing corporate owner Dr Al Kwong Hing and together they have developed BKH Holdings which consists of seven branches.

Chris said: 'There are two points that will differentiate BKH Healthcare in the marketplace.

'Firstly, it is our belief that people who are existing stakeholders in a business will deliver a higher level of performance and behaviour as opposed to non-stakeholders.

'We do not want the business to be primarily owned by an investment institution and the aim of BKH Healthcare is for it to be a stakeholder-led business.

'Secondly, we are completely focused on a "win, win, win" situation which means that patients, individual team members within the business and the owners themselves all benefit from their involvement with us.

'The term "dental corporate" in the UK has had bad press in recent years, with overwhelming feedback from people both inside and outside of existing corporates tending towards the negative. There seems to be a notion of putting profit before people and, in the last 15 years, corporates have been around, their reputation has been marred.

'BKH Healthcare aims to create a vibe which will mean that people will want to work for us. The idea is to be commercial but also fun, fair and exciting, creating a place where everyone can realise their full potential.

'It is not merely a case of suggesting that people are more important than profit, rather that people and profits have equal standing within the organisation.'

BKH Healthcare will be launched by Chris Barrow and Dr Al Kwong Hing at The Dentistry Show 2012 on Friday 2 March at 2pm, Stand B3.

For more information about BKH, call 0161 820 5466 or email Alan at al@bkh.co.uk, Chris at chris@bkh.co.uk or visit www.bkh.co.uk.

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Comments

Soundbites and ego?
Profit is all important for corporates.
They are not charities!

Posted by richard8466 26/1/12 at 08:28

How I hate the word 'stakeholder'. A dreadful NuLabour-speak invention. Every time I hear 'stakeholder' I picture the late, great Peter Cushing as the 'ultimate stakeholder' - Dr Van Helsing!

Posted by docholliday 26/1/12 at 12:00

Thanks for the early responses. We knew that as soon as the existence of the company became public we would receive what I call the "roses and rotten vegetables".

To Richard8466 - our vision is to create a corporation where profits and people have equal standing.

I absolutely "get it" that we are not a charity (although we have already agreed a CSR programme) and have to provide a return to shareholders as well as patients, suppliers and team members.

We are committed to minimise (if possible avoid) institutional shareholders and focus on internal investment from owners, clinicians and employees.

To docholliday I offer the opportunity to suggest an alternative terminology to Stakeholders if that doesn't suit. John Lewis call them partners. Whatever it takes.

What UK dentistry is going to have to get used to is that everybody in BKH - the CEO Dr Al Kwong Hing, the MD (me), the Board, the management team (there are 9 of us already), the clinicians, the team and the patients - will have a voice through the dental media and through our own social media - to give us the feedback that is necessary to create a company that folks will be proud to associate with.

You are going to be amazed and perhaps confused by our transparency.

I'm quite happy to sit with my head in the stocks at the BDA, The Showcase or anywhere else.

Judge us on our results in the next 3 years - just hold the rotten veg for a bit while we get going please?

Its only been 26 days......

--This post was last edited on 26/1/12 at 19:24--

Posted by chrisbarrow 26/1/12 at 19:12

Excellent! Never knowingly undersold......

Posted by docholliday 26/1/12 at 20:40

I wish this new corporate good fortune going forward. I feel the main problem for corporates is that organising dentists is like herding cats, Most dentists just want to escape and run their own practice asap. If the corporate can find a way to give empoyees a meaningful share in the success, it will stand a better chance of retaining staff for longer. HIgh staff turnover is not something patients appreciate. In addition, good dentistry comes down to personal ethics and individual ability. Allowing that to flourish within a system trying to deliver numbers is harder for a corporate than a typical three or four person private practice.
The goal of course will be economies of scale, efficient management, full premises utilisation etc. I'm sure Chris has learned a lot from Boots and others, so he is the man if anyone can do it.Incidentally, Boots rejected my application, so I was forced to start my own practice, which is now 100% private, and reasonably successful as measured by my patient questionnaires. I'm still puzzled as to why I was 'not suitable'. If you look after your patients, they will look after you. Simples

Posted by edwardmk 27/1/12 at 09:32

--This post was last edited on 29/1/12 at 22:23--

Posted by Doc458 28/1/12 at 11:12

comment removed

--This post was last edited on 29/1/12 at 13:43--

Posted by vess_bb 29/1/12 at 11:16

Mr Barrow, don't you think it is hypocritical to work 10 years for IDH and then to say 'well corporates are bad but now since I am making my own, this one will be brilliant'?

Posted by vess_bb 29/1/12 at 11:35

!

--This post was last edited on 29/1/12 at 21:16--

Posted by 32daant@gmail.com 29/1/12 at 20:46

I assume your new venture is a private set up? If so you will be competing with the nhs.Now you can argue the service argument,but at present particularly ,this will be tough,with the extra layers of management required,to be covered by the fees generated by the dentists.Getting the right calibre of associates to generate this will be tougher still.As far as I'm aware there are very few if any corporates making a profit.They are all bought and sold on the dream that the next lot can do better than the previous lot.Boots was a classic example,as is jd Hull-massive losses. You are either very brave or naive.In my opinion this is not the time for large capital expenditure but if its OPM .....

Posted by gordie 30/1/12 at 07:47

Yes I agree Gordie, I cannot see how corporates can make a profit. Interestingly I see IDH are still seeking to buy practices - I got a flyer the other day

Posted by Doc458 30/1/12 at 08:20

i think idh buy nhs/mixed and use the nhs as a cash cow.They can use the nhs carrot to up sell.How long for I don't know.The govt will be looking for more control after the obudsman crucifies dentistry for gaming/conning.Its dificult to compare dentistry in this country to models in other countries as they don't have the nhs but in most others the corporate model doesn't exist. Its still a cottage industry with small outfits.When I started my boss belonged to a group who had about 50-60 associates working over various practices on the fee /item nhs. THey did well,and sold to one of the original corporates. I always remember him saying to me "they see something that we after all these years can't-we don't know what it is but they're paying top dollar". They then sold to another lot after a few years before it all went tits up.

Posted by gordie 30/1/12 at 08:48

Hello all,

Dr Al Kwong Hing here, CEO of Barrow Kwong Hing Group of Companies. I have followed all the feedback to the interviews of Chris and myself this past week about BKH Healthcare and I’d like to add a response of my own.

First, I apologise for the use of the word stakeholder – you are correct, we want owners – and as such, each and every person who is a part of our corporation will receive shares in the corporation. This is because one of our core beliefs is personal engagement and in my experience I have found the best way to achieve this is by making a person an owner.

Second, I won’t be responding to any negative comments about the character of any of our owners or anything that intends to be malicious and hurt someone’s feelings - or as Chris puts it, the rotten veg.

I am simply asking for your patience as we try to bring benefits to UK dentistry and have fun along the way. As part of our open and honest approach, I do not hide behind pseudonyms in my emails – I am al@BKH.co.uk and my phone is 07772 738036 (UK) or 001 416 805 3100 (US).

Posted by Dr Al Kwong Hing 3/2/12 at 16:25

Hello

Have you considered the legal implications of setting up a dental corporate?
Will your "employees" be protected insofar as superannuation is concerned?
As I understand it, if a dentist comes to work for a corporate organisation the right to superannuation may be lost and perhaps there should be incentives offered to substitute that loss?
We are on hand to offer legal advice if needs be, to anyone considering this as an option.

Jonathan Jacobs
RossLegal LLP
0161 720 7200

Posted by maxjacobs67 9/2/12 at 08:33

Superan only exists in the nhs sector,so I'm not sure it applies in this set up.

Posted by gordie 9/2/12 at 12:53

I worked at IDH for two years and 6 months as Director of Private Sector Development

Posted by chrisbarrow 10/2/12 at 16:05

A quick exploration of the data available on IDH will show that the company has been very profitable for successive owners. That'll be why Carlyle bought in at the end of 2010. http://www.carlyle.com/Company/item1676.html

These people know what they are doing.

Posted by chrisbarrow 10/2/12 at 16:07

There was very little up-selling of private treatment in the NHS division of IDH whilst I was there. The focus was on the achievement of UDA targets - which occupies lots of energy!

I'm all for open debate - based on facts - and I agree that the absence of corporates from these forums creates the conditions in which rumour, speculation and misinformation can produce some pretty wild conspiracy theories. I don't actually believe that dental corporates were involved in the Kennedy assassinations but sometimes you would think so.

Part of the BKH Culture will to be as open and transparent as commercial reality allows. Al and I have that at the core of our beliefs.

We don't think we have all the answers - we do think we can make good and bad decisions - we will always be open and listening to constructive feedback.

We will not take part in or listen to condemnation, criticism, complaint - especially when based on fiction.

Posted by chrisbarrow 10/2/12 at 16:10

Don't know about idh but jd hull were bust when axa bought in

Posted by gordie 10/2/12 at 18:50

With all due respect to the authors on here as a Dentists, and having read some of the comments, it is this kind of attitude that will eventually elude you the patients that you so desire.

If you put yourself out in the private arena then you are playing do a different audience than in the public sector, they are paying money they don’t just expect a result, they demand it. That paying client doesn’t care how you put that brilliant smile on their face, nor as in the case of the legal profession, how you got that result in the court room. In fact I think its fair to say in most instances they haven't a clue if you have done a good or a bad job. The client works on the 'end result’ factor, and more so what a nice time they had getting the results (appertaining, without doubt to your customer service). Those results and that customer service will bring recommendations and follow up appointments.

I don’t know whether BKH will achieve the results they want, they are certainly trying to do things differently and their strategy and ethics are being set out as open and honest, with a view to include every one within that working team.

I do believe they are correct in the ‘happy attitude’ in that if you make someone responsible in the work place, and give them a financial onus, then that attitude will infiltrate down to the team on mass, and will then pass down to the paying client. John Lewis is the perfect example, and let us not forget Sports Direct.

Maybe this kind of mind set is what is greatly needed, maybe it will change the face of ‘services’ not just in the Dental arena, but in all offered services be they paid, or not.

But, any paid professional these days who regards himself higher than the sum of his clients and working team is old school and bound to fail in today’s economic market.

Go for it BKH

--This post was last edited on 11/2/12 at 09:19--

Posted by RedDucati 10/2/12 at 19:07

--This post was last edited on 11/2/12 at 06:27--

Posted by Doc458 10/2/12 at 20:50

Thanks RedDucati - appreciated.

Let me tell you, launching a new corporation is a hugely time-consuming exercise. In September I was a self-employed consultant with a team of 1 - now I'm a company director with an owner-management team of 8 and a support team of 7 freelancers.

Just keeping up with the plot is an undertaking and we have started using a Facebook-like application called Yammer to allow inter-company comms - I now have to check in there frequently during the day to keep tabs.

Our business plan is evolving daily - we head up blind alleys and have to turn back, we forge progress and make breakthroughs, we are working 7 days a week (as you can see).

Stephen Covey calls it "harvest time" and we will be like this for a while yet.

Big launch at The Dentistry Show - come and see us on B3.

Posted by chrisbarrow 12/2/12 at 11:04

I think one of the major hurdles the Corporate might face is the response from the other Dentists. They will no doubt see you as a rival, as Dentistry like Doctorate and Law, is a very closed and old, professional shop, not usually open to new ideas!

I think the success of your Corporate will depend somewhat on how positively you channel that negativity and turn it to your advantage.

“Your job is not to judge what you make. Your job is to make it, and get it out into the world. Others can judge it once it’s out there, but you can’t hold it back by judging it beforehand.”

Once again I do wish you all the very best of luck .

Posted by RedDucati 13/2/12 at 08:27

Oh down arrowed.

Ok Private Dentists on here let me ask you one simple question:-

How many of you guys know where your clients have sprung from, how many of you know what your clients core beliefs are? How many of you on here think well that doesn't matter one jot?

Did they come back because of recommendations? was it follow up appointments? Or was it the parents of children who, after the NHS closed their books you offered a place to, on the proviso that they registered with your surgery?

Fast forward to today and the new NHS's structure. Were these same NHS surgeries, which closed their books, are now about to be paid by the amount of people registered on their books, not by the amount of work they do on the patients.

How are you going to keep those middle income families coming back to your surgery and spending their money with you?

Well firstly you could work on recommendations, then of course you could work on results, obviously your customer service it second to none, but once the NHS books reopen lets face it, those same patents can, and will get that treatment for a lot less money. Ok the surroundings might not be as salubrious as you guys can offer, but if you shut your eyes and think of England what's a few gold fish between Dentists.

So what do you work on then? In order that the clients keep walking back through the door, for a treatment that they could otherwise get for a lot less money elsewhere.

You work on their ethics

You give them a company whose core beliefs are honest and open. You give them a company who cares about its patients not about the money. You give them a company that wants to eradicate poverty, and not only that who are actively partaking or linked in fund raising activities. You give a company that cares about its staff, one that wants them to be included financially in the structure of that company, who wants to listen to the things they have to say, who is interested. You give them a company who brings young dentists in to the community and trains them. You give them a company who because of this is actively make jobs in the community where your clients live. Finally, you give them a Team that truly believes in those ethics, through a Corporate, that all believe in the same outcome.

So, instead of gold fish you give them ethics on that coffee table in that surgery, you say to that client, you spend your money with us and this is what we are giving back.

That's game set and match, don't believe me? ask the Co-op

Posted by RedDucati 13/2/12 at 11:51

RedDucati wrote:

You give them a company who cares about its patients not about the money.

Firstly, Red Ducati, it would be nice to have a little of your background so that we can understand where you are coming from.

Secondly,it is all very well to say that you want a company who cares about its patients and not about the money, but how does a company exist if they do not care about the money? Surely they have to be profitable in order to exist?

Posted by dannypretorius 13/2/12 at 14:35

We all know that RedDucati means a company that cares as much about people as about the money - good people and no money equals insolvency. Good money and poor people equals unsustainability.

Good money and good people is where the best companies in the world live - Apple, Four Seasons, Pixar, Pret a Manger and many others.

Imagine a dental corporation that wants to create good people and good money - what would that look like?

RedDucati's comments on ethics are in perfect harmony with our thinking - we are developing a BKH Culture - a mission statement that embodies these beliefs.

The chattering masses will say "it cannot be done" - they always do. Then somebody does it - and they try and find ways to drag the company and its leaders down.

So it always goes.

But we will do it anyway - watch.

Posted by chrisbarrow 13/2/12 at 15:01

--This post was last edited on 14/2/12 at 11:47--

Posted by RedDucati 13/2/12 at 17:50

Dear RedDucati,

As a dentist who daily receives updates from this thread I am both intrigued and irritated by your posts, or should I say rants? Chris by his comment “We all know that RedDucati means a company that cares as much about people as about the money - good people and no money equals insolvency. Good money and poor people equals unsustainability.” appears to know who you are but, probably like most on this site, I haven’t a clue who/what RedDucati is, as a person/company

I appreciate that you have enlightend us a little as to who you are but it does beg the question, “Have you nothing better to do with your time than post on a dental thread when you have nothing to do with dentistry?” As dannypretorius said “what is your agenda?”

Hopefully someone can explain what the drift of your three posts is about as I cannot for the life of me fully get to the bottom of what you are trying to say. Or are you just having a go at the profession?

As someone who first introduced the concept of the ”John Lewis of Dentistry” in May last year (2011) I do get slightly irritated when people jump on the bandwagon without fully embracing employee ownership, which is the foundation stone of John Lewis.

John Lewis is about everybody owning the company not just management. In dentistry, that means hygienists, therapists, nurses, receptionists and cleaners i.e. all that are employed, not just the dentists.

As a dentist I also take exception to your comment “That paying client doesn’t care how you put that brilliant smile on their face, nor as in the case of the legal profession, how you got that result in the court room. In fact I think its fair to say in most instances they haven't a clue if you have done a good or a bad job. The client works on the 'end result’ factor, and more so what a nice time they had getting the results (appertaining, without doubt to your customer service). Those results and that customer service will bring recommendations and follow up appointments.”

I can assure you that, as a dentist, I do care how that brilliant smile is put on their face and I do care about doing a good job. Your comment implies that it doesn’t matter how we achieve it so long as we achieve it with good customer service. That is not how I, and most of my profession, see it.

Simon Gallier

Posted by simonwdw 14/2/12 at 06:26

Dear Chris,

Firstly, good luck with your new venture. I have known you as long as most in dentistry and you have certainly breathed new life into the profession.

I do believe that that there is room in our profession for a new way of doing things. One of the main issues we face is that there are Corporates and there are Corporates. Yes, same word but completely different beasts.

I do believe that you are trying to build a good one but I do take a slight issue with one of your posts about “Corporates”. You stated a week ago “A quick exploration of the data available on IDH will show that the company has been very profitable for successive owners. That'll be why Carlyle bought in at the end of 2010. http://www.carlyle.com/Company/item1676.html

These people know what they are doing”.

IDH being profitable for successive owners doesn’t necessarily mean it’s a good thing.

Fred Goodwin was very good for RBS right up to the point that…..

Lehman Brothers was an amazingly profitable company right up to the point……

Healthcare is a unique business and dentistry is a unique business within healthcare. It is my view that the business of dentistry, like any business, must be profitable but the sort of returns on investment required by private equity/venture capital has no place in our business.

If the link to Carlyle’s web site is followed and you go to their home page you will find the following statement “Since starting Carlyle 24 years ago, we have been driven by a relentless pursuit of generating superior returns for our investors”.

That is a company which now controls nearly 10% of our profession. It might end in tears.

I know you don’t want that!

I look forward to raising a glass with you in Birmingham in March.

Simon Gallier

Posted by simonwdw 14/2/12 at 06:29

numpty calling ,red ducatti-explain then how super an works in private practice. Like Simon I have read your blogs and can't work out your agenda. But hey what do I know, I've only been doing this for 30 years and made quite a few mill in the process

Posted by gordie 14/2/12 at 07:30

Dear Mr Gallier

I was on here looking for a recommended Dentist! My only agenda is my toothache!!

You missed the first rule in business, never forget everyone is a potential client! Sorry if you found me irriating because I have an opinion about something that sounds really good in theory. I do hope I don't walk into your surgery, you could be mean with that drill, (do you treat your staff in the same superior manner?)

No I'm not having a go at Dentists, I think you do a good job but you are not higher that the sum of your clients, and once money swaps hands it superceeds your qualifications, you are a business like any other.

My comment with regard to your clients not realising whether you have done a good job, or a bad job is NOT being critical of Dentistry, and I know that you care about your clients. But, how does a client know if you have or have not done, a good job? you are the Dentist they are not. In conducting that work you could have done the worst job ever but a client wouldn't know that The only thing they have to work off, is the end result. Apologies if I offended you or any other dentists on this forum it was certainly not my intention.

Dear Gordie, seeing as you a few have millions in the bank maybe you should start your own corporate! Its not wise in a recession though to brag about the amount you have made, especially to the clients who are probably struggling to find the funds see a dentist on a regular basis (modesty is a really good thing to practise esp in the private sector) good luck though.

Posted by RedDucati 14/2/12 at 08:46

my point was to show you that some of us know what we are doing in dentistry because we are good at it. It was not showing off. You are not a potential client and I have no idea how this magazine lets the public onto a professional forum.
Through the years so many non dental "experts" have been telling the rest of us how it should be done. Thus far the majority have all gone the same way. Maybe this latest idea wil work-I don't know. The evidence for corporates thus far has not been good-maybe this will be the one that is different-its certainly brave in what is a deep recession. I wish them luck.

Posted by gordie 14/2/12 at 10:09

I take on board your comments with regard to the corporates and it must be annoying that you as professional people are not left to do the work that you are good at, and with very greatest respect have trained damn hard for.

I was simply trying to suggest,as a complete outsider that a charge of attitude might be what is needed to keep bringing in the clients. I wasnt being critical of anyone on here. You ALL do a damn good job

I have worked in business myself where the financial onus has been put on the staff and it does yield good results.

It is a new way of doing business, it is brave yes, and it goes completely against the way things have been done before, but good luck to them in my opinion

"You are not a potential client and I have no idea how this magazine lets the public onto a professional forum"

If you go to the top of the page there is a button "for patients" and on the drop down list 'find a dentist' thats how.

Posted by RedDucati 14/2/12 at 10:32

clearly the magazine needs to address that.If I wanted to "sell myself" to potential clients I wouldn't use this format. The public should not have access to this section of the magazine.Its been said many times before but patients by "their dentist" not a product. They buy the sausage as well as the sizzle.

Posted by gordie 14/2/12 at 11:07

Good point also, I never though about it like that!

People buying the whole thing. But the thing is now you have to stop them shopping at Aldi instead of Waitrose, and that will be hard work, on top of the hard work you do already!

I like that one "They buy the sausage as well as the sizzle" funny

I actually read the artical about the new business idea made up an account, just to comment and now can not delete it.

The public probably should not be on here, I agree

and on that note I am leaving

Posted by RedDucati 14/2/12 at 11:15

There is too much to comment on in this post, but as an aside to Red Ducati, in the unlikely event that you ever visit Truro, check us out on www.trurodentalcare.com
We're usually busy, but we'll find time to get you out of pain. There are lots of very conscientious dentists the length and breadth of Britain, including many of my colleagues locally. The challenge for any corporate is to get close to the standards set by those practices. Equalling or exceeding the standards of those practices already in place will be nigh on impossible without charging much more. However, any system which delivers ethical quality dentalcare has my full support. They will displace the bad eggs, and that is only fair.

Posted by edwardmk 14/2/12 at 11:58

I think RedDicati is a troll .he is hi jacking this thread with his own agenda .
He must have pretended to be a dental professional to log in to this thread .
Pioneers always have a tough time when they go into unknown territory ,and this venture will be no different .
The values and aspirations are in the right place . Chris promoted the customer/patient centred focus to a wide audience in dentistry .
But dentistry is a market distorted by the NHS with its dismal , grubby UDA culture

Posted by JPinder 14/2/12 at 21:08

I'm not a Troll I'm a paying client with ethics.

Money is short and I was simply trying to explain that in the future if people must spend money at their dentists, in choosing which dentist to approach they might look further into the ethics of that company. So BKH has a good approach.

This could be esp useful when a company is seeking to offer a corporate health plan to its employees. A company with strong ethics will not seek to employ the services of one without any, or very little. Nor indeed one that they believe to be in it purely to make money on the back of their employees health.

You obviously don't want to listen to that, because I am not a Dentist and therefore incapable of comment, from a level you clearly do not understand, which is one as the client. Which begs the question "just how much do you listen to your clients, and more so your staff"

Incidently that 'he' is a 'she' and I logged on as 'other', because whilst I'm not a Dentist, I am director of my own company, too.

Thank you for the offer of a Dentist 'edwardmk' it was very kind of you and I have manged to get sorted out. But thank you for you kind thoughts.

I bid you good day, and wish you and the Dentist here, good luck.

Posted by RedDucati 15/2/12 at 08:00

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